It's all about winning...

Yes, yet again, this is about the ongoing saga of Bunny aka skeptihater hater Vs Hater aka Skeptic / skeptihater in Keith Urban and Nicole Kidman’s world. I’m just going to call them bunnies and skeptics.

The weird thing is that I assumed that the bunnies just wanted the skeptics to stop bad mouthing Keith and Nicole. That’s what I would have thought. And I assumed that the skeptics wanted the bunnies to believe what they believed. Why would the bunnies hate the skeptics so much if the skeptics weren’t forcing their evil thoughts down their throats, right? Right?

Nope. The more I read, the more I realize that the skeptics don’t seem to care what the bunnies think. They just continue to express their often nasty and almost always skeptical opinions about Keith Urban and Nicole Kidman. The bunnies on the other hand don’t seem to be interested in changing the views of the skeptics … they seem to want to destroy the skeptics or at least their reputations. It seems very personal, to an outsider.

Funny…I checked the UrbanMythsRevealed and Skewer the Skeptics blogs and sure enough, they’ve seen this blog. Boy, I think I must have touched a nerve! I want to repeat…I like Nicole Kidman. I think she is a talented actress. I like Keith Urban…I think he is an exceptional entertainer. But in spite of that, the bunnies have decided I’m a skeptic. Yep… as far as they’re concerned, I hate Nicole and Keith, just like my buddies, the skeptics. It isn’t possible that someone unattached might read their blogs and comments and look at the personal pictures of the skeptics who are being made fun of, and think that this is abnormal behavior.

I’m not saying that hating on a couple of celebs is a great pastime…but again, the intensity of the bunny’s posts…the pure hate reflected in much of the blog and the comments, is more than odd. At least the skeptics are discussing public figures and not people who are private citizens, some of whom trusted the bunnies enough to expose their names, addresses and even personal pictures to.

So…I’m a hater according to the bunnies. I tried to post a comment to “defend” my position and make them understand what I have observed, but it is obvious that the moderators are terrified of having anything other than their “truth” posted there. Their defensiveness tells the story.

I am not a skeptic. Heck … I am not even sure what the term skeptic means relative to Keith and Nicole. All I have done is write a blog that explains what I see as an “outside” observer. Their reaction is really interesting. You see it looks like if you don’t reflect the opinions of the “bunnies” … you must be a skeptic. After all, only skeptics would disagree with them and if you don’t agree with them, you MUST be wrong and hate Nicole and Keith.

I find that amusing in an ironic sort of way. I’ve read repeatedly that one of the issues the bunnies have had is that the skeptics would not listen to them and always argued with their opinions. In fact, the skeptics didn’t tolerate any opinion that wasn’t equivalent to the skeptical view point. Interesting that the bunnies are completely intolerant of any opinion but their own, too! Do you see the irony, or is it just me?

There is no doubt in my mind that this is no battle to defend Keith Urban and Nicole Kidman. If it started out like that, it has evolved into something personal, in my opinion. It’s now a matter of attacking the skeptics and proving they are wrong. It’s a cyber battle against the skeptics, except skeptics seem oblivious to the fight. They plod away, posting their comments about their two less than favorite celebrities, while the bunnies are raging about them, and trying to “expose them” for some unknown reason.

Some examples of the very intense emotion aimed at the skeptics by the bunnies:

“Such a bitter pill they have to swallow, and swallow and swallow!

They make such fools of them selves over and over and over!LMAO

No wonder all the posters on E! are coming out of the walls laughing out loud at the silly jerks.”

Haters, you are looking very foolish.Better get back to old years gone by lies and pull up your old rants. That might work.You can talk to yourself again about that for a week or two. Foolish liars.”

"Vulgar is as vulgar does I guess!"

I guess when there are only your same old 4 year-old comments to post, and you've resorted to crawling in the gutter with the snakes, you end up speaking like them too.

If it wasn't so pathetic, I'd laugh! H e L L, I'll laugh anyway...BAHAHAHAHAHA!”

Can you hear the emotion in these comments? It’s disturbing, albeit interesting.

They obviously have spent and continue to spend a lot of time searching through message board threads, PM’s and emails to post the skeptics’ comments on their own blogs. I know it took me a bit of time to read through many posts to try to understand this phenomenon and find some representative comments. I have decided I don’t want to dedicate hours of my life to it. But it does, to me, illustrate a dangerous degree of obsession.

The intensity of their comments and the fact that they have obviously spent a lot of time “building their case” against the skeptics, tells me that this has reached an unhealthy level.
What harm has it done? In truth, the bunnies haven’t really hurt the skeptics who have been “outted.” Some may feel personally attacked (and they have been) and exposed (pictures of real people are posted and ridiculed – can you imagine? They’ve actually posted personal pictures of these people!) but in the end, it really doesn’t make a difference. If the skeptic is known to someone…no harm done. They already know them. If they don’t know them, then it’s just a picture of an anonymous person, right?

For me, the pictures mean nothing. I don’t know these people and I don’t know the names. Some are having a good time. Others seemed to be posed. They’re just a few normal looking average people to me. Where is the “exposure” by saying that this is Sally Smith from the midwest. She took her kids to a Keith Urban show. Or…this is Molly Brown from the west coast. She was seen wearing a tube top and looking like a hootchie mama at a Keith Urban show. So what? Are we in grade 8?? Besides the obvious yuck factor of people stealing other people’s personal pictures and posting them without permission, it really accomplishes little.

Of greater concern to me is where this may be leading. One blogger seemed to indicate that she was collecting information to hand over to Keith and Nicole’s attorneys. Come on…do we really believe that? I don’t think that Keith Urban or Nicole Kidman are going to put a lot of weight in the opinion of some clearly disgruntled fans who have a personal vendetta against some very outspoken X fans. If the official representatives were disturbed by the posts on the E site, action would have been taken and long ago. No, that is clearly not the case…so what is the purpose of these blogs?

My fear is that some of these folks on the “bunny” sites have taken this fight to the extreme and could actually harm someone. I read that one skeptic blogger was receiving threats toward her family. After reading some of the truly startling posts on the bunny sites, I have some serious concerns for the well being of the skeptics.

If you are a skeptic, be careful out there … I think Keith Urban and Nicole Kidman’s people are the least of your worries. I am concerned that the obsessive fans who have a personal beef with you are your major threat. Do stay safe and be careful what you post on the internet.

There are unscrupulous people out there in cyberspace who are spending a lot of time trying to find out information about you personally and who seem to want to and, may be capable of, doing you harm … and that could include physical harm.

This is just an opinion, but honestly, I think it’s a possibility.

Bunnies Vs Haters

Bunnies Versus Haters…

Let me introduce myself. I am a student of psychology. I am not a particularly ardent fan of Keith Urban’s music, nor of Nicole Kidman’s acting. I have enjoyed Nicole’s films and as a country music fan, appreciate Keith’s talent. I've always thought Nicole Kidman was a talented actress who blossomed after her split with Tom Cruise. I’m not a card carrying Keith Urban fan club member but I enjoy his music and have been impressed by his live shows. I am not a poster on message boards, for example, and I don’t have copies of his pictures or magazine articles on my hard drive. I have been to see him live five times over the years…my first show in 2003. So, I am someone who appreciates his talent and artistry.

As a moderate “fan” of both Keith and Nicole and a student of psychology, you can imagine my interest was sparked when a friend of mine told me of an internet “hullabaloo” involving Keith Urban fans (and X fans). She described it as "the Bunnies Vs the Haters." I couldn’t resist visiting the websites and blogs she sent to me to find out what this was / is all about and wow, I was hooked after my first few visits.

My impression…it appears that Keith Urban has some of the most passionate fans … one might say pathologically passionate … than most any other artist as far as I can see. It also looks like when Keith married Nicole Kidman, a rift formed in his fan base.

Why was that? Were some of his fans jealous? At first, I thought that might be the case, but I think that is really a very small minority, after reading through pages (and pages and pages) of posts about this union.

Apparently, a certain fairly large percentage of his fans did not like that Keith was getting involved with the famous Aussie actress. Many felt that being in a relationship with Ms Kidman would over shadow Keith’s talent, as her fame eclipsed his by far. Some thought this was a “contract” relationship, based on each participant using the other to gain fame, particularly fame in Oz for Keith. Many thought that the relationship with Ms Kidman changed Keith and he was no longer the humble simple man they thought he was. Some felt there were too many lies told as the relationship developed. For many reasons, this group had a “skeptical” view of this relationship. Thus…the “skeptics” were born. They don’t accept that this relationship is as rosy as the press represents to the public and many believe that is a product of media manipulation by Nicole (and Keith).

Another group, I’ll call them the "bunnies" (because that’s what they were named by the “skeptics”), are ardent fans of both Keith & Nicole. This group wants Keith and Nicole to be happy and seem to believe everything they read about the love story. Some were originally Keith fans and adopted Nicole after they married. Others were Nicole fans and came to admire Keith because of the union. Most believe that Keith and Nicole can do no wrong. They will not tolerate anyone criticizing either Keith or Nicole and will do anything, and by the looks of it, I mean ANYTHING to protect Keith and Nicole’s … well, I’m not sure what they’re protecting, but they appear to be protecting Keith and Nicole from the skeptics and their opinions.

There are a couple of internet sites that allow people to express their opinions of celebrities with limited editing. One is the E Online message boards. Currently, there are a handful of threads related to Keith and Nicole … one called the Positive Thread, one called the Negative Thread and a couple of others that are “mixed.” I read through some of these threads and I have to say that there is some nasty stuff posted there about these two. Whether there is any proof of what is said, it is definitely not ‘fan’ friendly. There are also “fans” (aka bunnies) who stick up for Keith and Nicole vehemently, and occasionally bash the “skeptics” for their opinions.

The skeptics usually start off discussing Keith and Nicole (and they are not kind), but the thread inevitably turns ugly when the bunnies come on board, and make it personal. No matter how often the Moderators suggest that it’s OK to post anything about the celebrities, but not about other posters, the bunnies cannot help but personally attack the “skeptic” posters, in defense of Keith and/or Nicole. It’s predictable…and as I read post after post, pretty obvious that the “bunnies” were unable to distinguish between bashing the celebs Vs bashing other posters.

In addition to the E boards, there is a blog called Urban Myths…and believe me, there are lots of “myths” discussed there. Again, not exactly fan friendly, but definitely entertaining! There are blogs, spoof songs, fictional conversations, pictures and comments posted that can keep you in stitches if you have a few hours to read and aren’t easily offended. The degree of myth busting about these two celebs varies with the blogger. You can tell there are a number of people writing the blogs and so, the degree of snarkiness varies. This site allows (or used to) free discussion about the topics by skeptics and bunnies alike and so, everyone’s opinion was represented. The site is now moderating all comments, so that it’s hard to know whether all posters can express their views. But as I read through the older blogs, I was impressed with the tolerance the blog owner/s showed in allowing all manner of responses. Again, the skeptics were generally posting about Keith and/or Nicole, and the bunnies were getting personal. It’s a recurring theme.

The bunnies were not happy that there were sites that said bad things (and believe me … bad things were said) about their idols. It was very interesting to read how personally these folks took the criticism. I didn’t quite understand how personally they were taking it as I read through the blogs and comments, until they started to erupt.

A few private message boards have apparently developed to allow for more open communications about Keith and Nicole. I’m not privy to those sites, but apparently the discussions are even more “open” because participants assume they were in a ‘safe’ forum free from prying bunny eyes. As bizarre as it sounds, bunnies have infiltrated the private skeptic boards with a entitled sense of righteousness, in order to record the posts and opinions of skeptics and “reveal” them to the world. What for? I’m not sure. It’s the most bizarre thing I’ve seen for … well … forever!!

This back and forth exchange has been going on for some time. Now…the bunnies have gone on the offensive. The criticism levied against Nicole Kidman and Keith Urban incensed this group so much that they’ve struck back. Struck back at the skeptics in defense of Keith and Nicole, I guess.

They have essentially stalked the skeptics (now called haters) for years, collecting comments, private emails, private messages and in some cases, private discussions, only to use that information “against” the haters. The bunnies have even taken pictures of the various people out of their own personal photo albums. Like I said, it’s fanatic espionage at the highest level. And if not so perverted, I’d find it hysterically funny. (I have actually found it pretty funny, even with the obvious hatred focused toward the “haters”)

So, the attack of the bunnies has started. And it is as vicious as any attack I’ve seen. If you remember the Monty Python movie – “Holy Grail,” there was a vicious bunny in that movie. Well, I think that one was a kitty cat…if a bunny can be a kitty cat…compared to the bunnies turned skeptihater haters.

You should have seen the first site, a blog called “Urban Myths Revealed.” It posted comments / emails / private messages made by “skeptihaters” from as long as four years ago and tried to “out” the individual posters by naming them (even using real names, if that is to be believed) and posting pictures (or partial pictures – teasing readers into believing there would be more reveal coming). It included pictures of the “skeptics” with names and locations and even employment information. Accusations of use of multiple screen names, spreading of hate over the internet, feeding all the gossip sites with lies about Keith and Nicole, of stalking Keith, and of defacing public property in Nashville were thrown out there. Comments by the bunnies were startling in their intensity.

The stated intent was to “out” the skeptics and provide their information to Keith and Nicole’s lawyers so that they could sue them. I suspect this site was shut down, possibly by an external authority, because all of a sudden it was gone and when it returned, none of the original content was there. It was a shell of its former self. There is still an occasional picture posted there and at times, some comments from the bunnies … justifying “outing” the skeptics / haters. But it has lost its sting.

Some of the comments made by the “skeptihaters” (new label for the skeptic aka haters) were really over the line. I don’t know enough about Keith Urban or Nicole Kidman to know if there was any truth to their comments, but some were plain ludicrous. However, the comments WERE aimed at celebrities and so, they were arguably fair game. Celebrities put themselves out there for public scrutiny and likely expect that there will be some negative as well as positive discussion. In fact, the comments on the E board, for example, were not isolated to that site. Many of the gossip sites (dlisted; Lainey Gossip, Awful Truth, Perez Hilton etc.) made similar comments as those posted on E or the Urban Myths Blog.

The comments by the bunnies aka skeptihater haters were brutal. The intent was obviously to slay the skeptihater … destroy them since they’d “hurt” Keith and Nicole. The degree by which the bunnies took the comments about Keith or Nicole personally was startling. It is one of the most bizarre phenomenon I’ve ever witnessed. The skeptihaters were attacked by the bunnies with such vitriol and nasty righteousness that it actually made me giggle in shock, while the hair on my neck stood on end.

One poster wrote that skeptics “eventually scattered like cockroaches to form their own skeptic boards and talk about each other. The real mental cases began getting booted off their own boards and wound up on the E board starting KUNK threads. They are really the lowest of the low of the skeptics. So low, even the skeptics don't want them.” Another wrote: “this last group of haters are the bottom of the barrel. Reading the E board now is like reading comments from a mental ward. They go beyond logic, they reach the core of ugliness, and they are, frankly, disturbing.” One of the leaders said “the time is now, and I don't want to miss it. I haven't invested years of my life into this, I came late in the game. I knew people who knew people etc.” This poster, who made many comments about the skeptihaters having multiple screen names ultimately admitted to having more than one herself. Another posted this: “XXXX F*CKIN LEA! HA! I just got the link to this blog. My Sunday prayers have been answered! Listen, XXXXXX is the biggest douchebag, all out liar EV-ER.”

Get my point? The ‘skeptihaters’ limited their comments, albeit nasty, to Keith Urban and Nicole Kidman. Gossip at it’s all out nastiest. Truth? There may have been some truths interspersed in the speculation and opinion. But at least Keith Urban and Nicole Kidman are public figures and I’m sure they are used to the fact that they are subject of much discussion. There are numerous sites on the net discussing them, including gossip sites, and several blogs.

The ultimate in irony has happened. The bunnies became the haters. Some of the comments were down right scary and the intensity of their hate was palpable. Imagine people spending years gathering copies of people’s emails, message board posts and private messages, in order to build a case to “expose” them as “haters” and in doing so, taking great pleasure in the process.

OK…it’s beyond insane. And now, one poster has started a “skewer the skeptics” site under a different screen name and again, is promoting a bunny frenzy of hatred toward the “skeptihaters.”

I’m not really sure what to think of this. Obviously the skeptics have some issues with Keith Urban and Nicole Kidman that could well be labeled antifan activity. But the Bunnies turned “skeptihater haters” are far more worrisome to me. Obsessive to the highest degree. Willing to out people whom in some cases they know…because these people have criticized their idols, Keith and Nicole? This displays an abnormal degree of obsession, in my opinion.

I think it’s a reflection of society and the degree to which celebrity worship has evolved. These women have actually spent hours of their lives gathering the “proof” that the skeptihaters have lied about Keith and Nicole … they’ve spent hours at it. Hours. Of their own lives…building a case against a bunch of people who post on blogs and message boards about two celebrities. It’s a degree of protectiveness that I think, has crossed the line of normalcy.

Bunnies…aka skeptihater haters … step away from your key boards. Look around. Do you see your families? Your kids or your husbands or your parents or your friends or your co-workers? Honestly…that’s real life. Enjoy it. Stop the insanity (thank you, Susan Powder).

Keith and Nicole are not worried about a few X fans who don’t like them and gossip about them on the internet. I think that they may be a bit more concerned about YOU … who would actually spend this amount of time to “protect” them.

If the “skeptihaters” represent a threat to Keith or Nicole’s reputation (or person), they have teams of people with legal expertise who will act appropriately and within the legal system to deal with it. But it may not be the skeptihaters who are getting their attention. The kind of fan obsession the “skeptihater haters” are showing is the type, in my opinion, that sometimes turns dangerous. One blogger has received threats aimed at her children. Can you imagine?

Perhaps Keith and Nicole’s people should pay more attention to the X-bunnies turned skeptihater haters, than to the original skeptics. For the original skeptics, move on gals. Either find another actress or country music star to enjoy … or admit that you are still a fan of Nicole Kidman and/or Keith Urban. For the skeptihater haters…please realize how ridiculous you look and how frightening your hatred of some strangers, who happen to post negative comments about a couple of celebrities, has become.